What is the Great Delusion?

by Mike Ratliff

9 The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, 10 and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11 Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, 12 in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thessalonians 2:9-12 ESV)

Back when I was a Dispensationalist I remember listening to Hal Lindsey or some of the teachers at the church I was going to at that time teach on these things, but I never quite sunk my teeth into it. I remember never being fully convinced about the Eschatology or that the Church would be secretly Raptured away and miss the Tribulation. I heard a comment by R.C. Sproul the other day say that he isn’t sure which Eschatological view is correct, but he did know of two that he was totally convinced were not correct and were in fact terrible error. The two he spoke of that he was sure that were wrong was Full Preterism and any view that incorporated Dispensationalism. He was fine with Partial Preterism, Postmillenialism, and Amillenialism. Why? Each is Biblically based rather than based in what people want to hear.

There is much speculation about what the lie or delusion is that God sends upon those who refuse to love the truth. To discern what this lie is we need to study this passage from 2 Thessalonians 2 in context. Who is Paul writing to in this book? He wrote it to believers in Thessalonica. Some of them were shaken because someone had lied to them about the coming of the Lord and the gathering of the Saints unto Himself.

1 Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we ask you, brothers, 2 not to be quickly shaken in mind or alarmed, either by a spirit or a spoken word, or a letter seeming to be from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come. (2 Thessalonians 2:1-2 ESV)

Then Paul explains the order of things:

3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4 who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And you know what is restraining him now so that he may be revealed in his time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, 10 and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11 Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, 12 in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thessalonians 2:3-12 ESV)

Now, let us ask some questions of this passage. First, what is the lie that God actually sends out? Whatever it is it has to do with the Second Coming of our Lord and the gathering of the saints (v1). Whatever the lie is it is concerning the gathering of the saints before the tribulation begins. Second, Who are the recipients of this lie? This is speaking of some sort of doctrinal error that people want to hear and it comes from God. Therefore, those who believe this lie are professing Christians. Look at v3. Who would be deceiving the Thessalonians but other Christians teaching doctrinal error? Therefore, God is sending a lie upon professing Christians who do not love the truth. Third, Why would God send out a lie to His own people for them to be deceived? The answer is in v10. These are professing Christians, but they are not genuine because they do not love the truth. Instead they are in idolatry and God sends upon them a spirit of stupor so that they will believe that lie. He is giving them what they want and love, but it leads to destruction.

So what is the doctrinal error? Whatever it is, it is very popular and deeply believed by vast numbers of professing Christians. It is so popular that when any Bible teacher stands against it he is persecuted, smitten, ostracized, and made an example for all to see. The lie is taught by most of the pastors and teachers in the Church today. This is what people want to hear so they preach it. Satan is not doing this. God is doing this. Why? It is to separate His people from those in the Church who are not His people.

What is the doctrinal error? Does it mean that all who believe it are condemned? We must pray for God to give us wisdom and discernment so that we will know what the truth is. We live in a time of great deception. There are very good and popular preachers who are deceived in this, whatever it is. Another clue for us is that the majority of professing Christians believe this lie and only the few do not. Let us pray that God will open our eyes and give us the boldness to tell the truth. Perhaps those in this error will be drawn into the light. God’s will be done. Soli Deo Gloria!

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53 thoughts on “What is the Great Delusion?

  1. Amen.

    I want the truth. Only the truth. If I am wrong about premil then I pray “God show me, that I may not be damned!” But if I am right I pray that others see the truth before it is too late and that they not be damned. God save our souls and glorify your Son. That is all that is important. God save us. Pour our your Spirit Lord. Show us the truth and save us.

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  2. Interesting. One of the accusations leveled against me by my former pastor was “But she wants the truth at all costs!” (wow, what an HONOR that was!)

    uhh… well I guess that gave me my answer whether to stay or go!

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  3. Good, good, good article Mike! Rachel, please get the books we suggested, especially Kim Riddlebargers and then go from there. His book is easy to read and understand. He isn’t one of these preachers and teachers who add alot of ‘fluff’ to their books. Not that he can’t, but he doesn’t so us simple folk can understand! 🙂

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  4. “…The two he spoke of that he was sure that were wrong was Full Preterism and any view that incorporated Dispensationalism. He was fine with Partial Preterism, Postmillenialism, and Amillenialism. Why? Each is Biblically based rather than based in what people want to hear.”

    Until a week or two ago, I did not know what any of these terms meant (except dispensationalism…I only knew that because a dispensationalist taught me the pre-trib rapture theory). When I learned there was no pre-trib rapture through study alone with my Bible, determined to get to the truth, I decided I would never again get myself all tangled up in theories and titles and doctrines of men. This is not to say some of the doctrines out there are not truthful. But I learned back then how easily the devil can confuse, and I decided to let the Holy Spirit teach me from then on, just me and Him (and the sermons I hear on Sunday from my dear pastor who I adore, but still check up on in the Word 🙂 ).

    Reading my Bible, I never, as I said, even heard of these different millennium views. This is all very new to me. Neither had my husband, who had it drilled into him from his mother since he was born again as a teenager to ignore books and commentaries…not because there aren’t wonderful commentaries, but because “the battlefield is the mind” was her mantra, and she wanted him to grow in the Lord from a babe in Christ as safe from error as possible.

    Now I tell you all this because reading the Bible with these cautions to stick with the Word, both my husband and I (separately) came away from the Word alone taking the “thousand years” simply as Revelation speaks of it. Both of us are truly surprised there is any interpretation other than what it says – in Chapter 19 the Lord returns with His saints glorified, in Chapter 20 Satan is bound for a thousand years when the saints rule and reign with Christ on earth. Apparently this is called “Premillennialism”, but that is news to me. I just call it chapter 19 and 20. I assure you I do not believe this because it is what I “want to hear.” Contrarily and ironically, I believe this because I so desperately wanted the truth and only the truth that I avoided anything but the Word…so much so that I didn’t know these labels until a few weeks ago!

    If I’m not reading it correctly (or INTO it enough as it seems you must contort yourself to believe other than what it says plainly), then I do sincerely pray that God shows me the truth. But I assure you that I did not even know another view was out there at the time I arrived at the “premil” view from my reading. So if I’m deceived, it is not because my belief is not “Biblically based rather than based in what people want to hear.” I READ IT IN THE BIBLE WITH NO TEACHER JUST TO AVOID BEING LED ASTRAY.

    It is unfortunate that dispensationalism is going strong. I don’t know much about it other than the fact that being a student of that thinking is what gives strength to the theory of a pre-trib rapture. People think they are basing the pre-trib rapture on the Bible because they can no longer decipher men’s teachings from God’s, being indoctrinated and forgetting which is which. But apparently dispensationalists also hold to a premil view? Is it possible that people coming out of that teaching and distrusting it are throwing away all things associated with it just because they are associated with it? Is it also possible that the devil allowed some truth in the bigger lie so if he couldn’t fool people with the whole theory he could make them distrust the portion that is biblical? I have to wonder if being so well-versed in this or that doctrine isn’t more detrimental than I ever dreamed.

    God bless everybody here! 🙂

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  5. All: Read the Bible.

    Jeremiah 17:5 “Thus says the Lord, ‘Cursed is the man who trusts in mankind and makes flesh his strength and whose heart turns away from the Lord”

    Psalm 146:3-4 “Do not trust in princes, in mortal man, in whom there is no salvation. His spirit departs, he returns to the earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.”

    Isaiah 2:22 “Stop reguarding man, whose breath of life is in his nostrils; for why should he be esteemed?”

    Isaiah 8:20 “TO THE LAW AND TO THE TESTIMONY! If they do not speak according to this word it is because they have no dawn. And they will pass through the land hard pressed and famished, and it will turn out that when they are hungry, they will be enraged and curse their king and their God as they face upward. They they will look to the earth, and behold, distress and darkness, the gloom of anguish; and they wl be driven awway into darkness.”

    Who cares what someone else says is true or false in their human opinion. Satan used scripture in the garden. Does that mean all scripture is bad and to stay away from it??? God forbid. Satan knows what he’s doing. There is scripture in every endtime theology period, and yes DISPENSATIONALISM TOO. Does this mean it is all wrong? No, does it mean it is all right? No. What it means is we will never know what is right and what is wrong if we study theologies instead of the Bible, in context. THE ENTIRE BIBLE. Stop trusting in man, put down the books and pick up the word.

    Love in Christ,
    Rachel

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  6. I think where a lot of Dispensationalists (myself included) have gone wrong is in trusting in the Rapture, instead of in God alone.

    The threat of being “left behind” is simply the worst form of Arminian syncretism. It turns us away from Christ and onto ourselves, holding to a strict legalism in the hope that we will not be passed over at the Rapture. I lived in this trap for a *long* time, before being exposed to Reformed theology.

    Is the Rapture true? I’m not sure we can say for sure. But it should not be an issue, if we are trusting God. If He chooses to remove His church in this fashion, we will celebrate with Him in heaven on that Day. If He chooses to leave His people here to witness His wrath poured out, we trust that He will keep his promises — that He has chosen this bleak (in our eyes) prospect in order to bring about the greatest possible good, and His wrath will never fall upon His elect.

    The wrath of other humans that *are* under His wrath, though, is another story. But if it is His will that His saints go through the tribulation, He will also give us the strength to endure it. Do you fear that you will fall as Peter in the face of that terrible Day? Do not, for Christ will not lose even one that the Father has given Him.

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  7. Sarah,

    Hello there, I tried to send you an e-mail to get your website but it came back . I have hotmail so outlook doesn’t accept mail from me. I will try to e-mail you from work tomorrow and use my work e-mail which is also outlook, that way it should go through. Have a good evening.

    Love in Christ,
    Rachel

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  8. Sobering thoughts. I’m struck again with the seriousness of basing our beliefs solely on the Word of God. Let us be thankful that we have been given an anointing from the Holy One, so that we will not be led astray by these lies, as we study the Word in reliance on him (see I John 2:20-27)!

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  9. Once Confused,

    Your description of you journey shows us how devious the lie is and how hard it is to break away from unless God helps us. He has done that with us and so we should simply trust what the Bible says rather than what men say.

    In Christ

    Mike Ratliff

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  10. If we are to stop trusting man that would include R.C. Sproul. There are learned men who love Christ and have studied the Scriptures who have landed on different views of escatology. So when R. C. Sproul say he knows which ones certainly are not true he is presumptous and somewhat prideful in his own interpretation.

    It matters what you believe about salvation and the truths of the gospel. As far as the end times and its chronology, God has already laid out the complete scenario so whatever we believe may or may not be correct, but it doesn’t change the future and I’m not sure what it does to our walk before Him. What should affect us is not how things will take place, but that He is returning.

    There are several views that are legitimate and worth respect. As a sidenote, I hold to one of the views that cannot possibly be true. Oh well, back to the drawing board!

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  11. My drawing board is broken. 🙂

    I agree with Rick as well. Let’s simply focus on preparing for His return. Why? Because I believe it will be soon.

    In Christ

    Mike Ratliff

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  12. Henry Frueh (is it Rick?),
    Amen and amen! The important thing to do is search the Scriptures for ourselves and never think we have all the answers when entering discussions like this, because that is when we are in for a big fall. Possibly most important, we cannot judge the hearts of believers who have arrived at ANY belief or assume how or why they arrived at it. I have brothers and sisters in the Lord who hold to a wide array of beliefs, some of which I do and some of which I do not hold myself. We must remember whatever we do have that is 100% truth, we have it from the Lord only. So we cannot look down on one who is under a “category”, even if we look down on the category itself. Does that make sense? Two of my closest friends are dispensationalists, and they love the Lord, they seek the truth…they are not THE category! They are genuine in their belief! They believe what they believe because they believe it, not because they “love not the truth”. And if someone does love not the truth, that is not for us to know or judge anyway. Let us study to show ourselves approved unto God, diligently searching the Scriptures and most of all asking the Holy Spirit to guide us.

    God bless you!

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  13. Sharon,

    I am not advocating looking down on anyone. I am stating that we must be very careful right now because deception is deepening and the Church is very sick. Also, I am not saying that all in a catagory are evil and love not the truth. However, when “tradition,” or “my favorite Bible teacher says this…,” etc. is more important than objectively studying the Bible to get the truth then we have a problem.

    I would be surprised if all those who hold to Dispensationalism are the ones Paul was speaking of here. However, there are some who hold it way too tight and have morphed it into a religion of its own. They have huge followings and they are not trusting in Christ for their salvation, but another Jesus who is subordinate to their idea of the truth. I have had these “fellows” acutally accuse me of abandoning the Bible as the inerrant Word of God because I am not a Dispensationalist. These are the ones I beleive this is for.

    In Christ

    Mike Ratliff

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  14. Mike and I discussed this on one of his previous posts. Jesus said even He did not know when He was coming back (day and hour) but the Father has it in His hands. But the Bible is full of eschatological verses and themes, so what is God saying?

    1. God is saying “Watch for Me, I am coming!”.

    2. Keep searching the Scriptures, they will build your faith.

    3. Even if you cannot know the exact time, you must warn men about the consequences of My return.

    And MOST impotantly, we must look with anticipation for the unveiling of the coming King and our glorious gathering unto Him who is our life!!!. This is not just an event, it is THE event we who love the Lord Jesus are looking toward.

    Maranatha, maranatha. Thank you, Mike, for a site that not only believes God’s Word in all its fullness, but presents a hospitable forum for all who truly love Christ and His Word, even from different but legitimate perspectives.

    This blog is one that ministers to so many who need meat served with humility. You are a true servant of Christ.

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  15. Hi Mike,
    “However, when “tradition,” or “my favorite Bible teacher says this…,” etc. is more important than objectively studying the Bible to get the truth then we have a problem.”

    On this I wholeheartedly agree, Mike. And actually, the friends I spoke of are exactly the dispensationalists you describe…they become easily angered if you say anything that doesn’t line up with whatEVER that whole doctrine entails. (I’m starting to think I need to find out, just to understand where my brothers and sisters are coming from…I’m just so cautious about “how I listen” as I don’t want to introduce something to my thinking and accept it as truth unwittingly.) I just don’t want any dispensationalist reading this to feel judged for being where he/she is right now…and I’m sorry if I made you feel I thought you were doing that. I just know I fell into a belief once that I never quite understood but assumed in honesty to be truth, and so I understand how one can be deceived and still love the truth.

    But oh my – you are so right that we need to be aware that lies abound in the church and we need to check ourselves motive-wise and continually seek the truth.

    Love you brother,
    Once confused 🙂

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  16. Amen!

    No matter how many “legitimate” interpretations there are, in reality there is only ONE truth and one “true interpretation”. There are many interpetations because early on, in the beginning of the church, wolves crept in as teachers and slowly began introducing different interpretations of the scriptures than what the apostles taught was the actual meaning. We were warned by Jesus that it would happen and it did! There is only one truth of the end-time. One. It can be found ONLY in the scriptures.
    Lord save us! Lord sanctify us in Truth. Your Word is Truth.

    Love in Christ,
    Rachel

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  17. Amen Mike! I do love your site and all of the believers here so much. Discussion, even excited discussion, such as these have been, are good for our growth because we have to search out the scriptures! Iron on Iron brother. Thanks for such a wonderful forum.

    Love your Sister in Christ,
    Rachel

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  18. Amen Rachel. I totally agree. It is a wonderful forum and I love my brothers and sisters. Your all such a blessing to me. We are all united in most important matter.We all love our merciful Lord. Praise him

    In Him
    Deborah

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  19. I think their are many ways to be in delusion. An un repented sin, disobedience even though you might not be aware of it. I guess that is why we are to check daily and ask the Lord to show us. I also think that women are to be in submission of Godly men and Christ is the head of us all. I am blessed by the Godly men in here. Thank you !!

    In Him,
    Deborah

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  20. We really do believe that the good Lord gave us some of these men (you know, the dead guys now) to teach us. He does go through man to teach it the right way. No none of us have it all. But…….when you can put most all the reformation guys together and they basically say the same thing in their books and commentarys…….I really think it would be an unwise move to not read their life time long work. They have a wealth of information for us that would take us more than a lifetime to research. Sorry but after studying all the ‘other’ views, and at length, we have come to the conclusion that the reformers had it and was right. People object to creeds and catechisms, but THAT is precisly how the ‘churches’ got so messed up. They threw them out and just did their own thing. Calvin, Spurgeon, A.W.Pink and etc. did what the churches don’t do today and that is to use their Bibles!!

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  21. Mike…what a great posts…and this site has the best responses (postees)…love for truth is so obvious. The love for our Saviour is evident. This is so refreshing!

    On a personal note…as you know I have left my church – I am without a church home, though I visit a Baptist church down the road from my home, but it is not my “home” church…and with leaving the church I have experienced lonely times, but over all God has so blessed me with His peace. And though this walk has been painful, God has kept His promise to comfort and guide me…He is awesome!

    I am currently going through a “friendship in the breaking ” over my thoughts of Christ and the condition of the church. I have sent this friend numerous articles from both you and Henry (Rick) Frueh…only to have them criticized – in ways that make no sense at all. And though this alone is not what bothers me, for he can criticize me, you and Rick all he wants, but his beliefs about our Father is so twisted…and of course he cannot see it…to him we are twisted and deceived. But by the grace of God I will stand firm…I will stand up for truth (in love) about my Creator.

    I guess, though I know why, I am still amazed at the blindness. And this brings me back to my first point (sorry for rambling), this site is in a sense, is where I get fellowship…and though this could be a source of sadness, I look at it as a blessing!

    Thanks Mike! Thanks Rick! Thanks to all of you for being here and caring about truth and loving our Father!!

    In Christ,
    Sherry

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  22. I believe the Lord will send them a strong delusion that will remove any semblence of truth and make them wholly susceptible to believing the greatest lie of all, that Satan is Christ – the anti-christ.

    They will not only believe that lie, but they will be mesmerized by his every word. Just like God hardened Pharoah’s heart, so shall he remove His truth and and lead them into what they have desired all along. Remember, it is because they received not the knowledge of the truth, so in essence God helps the inevitable along.

    This verse is not dealt with at all today, and people have the impression that they will have a second chance. Even the Left Behind series teaches that. I do not believe that will be the case and lost people need to know that their time grows short.

    ************
    The devil held a counsel with his top demons. He ask what could they do to further deceive the people. One demon said, “Let’s tell them there is no heaven!”. Everyone thought that was good.

    Another demon said, “Let’s tell them there is no hell!”. Everyone thought that was even better.

    The last demon said, “Let’s tell them there is no hurry!!”. Satan himself thought that was the best.
    ******************

    I have one better that the church has adopted. “Let’s don’t tell them at all.”

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  23. Paul ,you said “Calvin, Spurgeon, A.W.Pink and etc. did what the churches don’t do today and that is to use their Bibles!!”
    Yes, Yes Yes!! 🙂

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  24. God bless the reformers. They were coming out of darkness and gave their lives to do it. They had limited sources, they were trying to go back to the beginning. Trying to get hold of the scriptures and the works of the early church. Now, we have these very resources that were so precious to the early reformers! And in our language! We are without excuse.

    Love in Christ,
    Rachel

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  25. Hi Paul,
    I get your point, and I think when one is no longer a babe in Christ and vulnerable, there is a place for commentaries for sure. But isn’t it comforting to know we don’t need a life-time of someone else’s work to be led into all truth? 🙂

    “But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, you shall abide in him.” – 1 John 2:27

    Let’s just guard the little ones in the flock, as it is so easy to be sucked into error, especially as we get closer to the return of our Lord. God bless you!…and everyone here!

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  26. Rick!
    “I have one better that the church has adopted. ‘Let’s don’t tell them at all.'”

    You said it! Perfectly put!

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  27. is it possible to be an agnostic on this issue? What if I simply say that I don’t have a handle on the issue of eschatology? Can I simply say that no one knows for sure? Is this something that we have to nail down in order to feel secure? What if I believe that no one can actually nail down the issue with absolute certainty, what happens then? Am I in danger of apostasy? Anyone have any answers? Shouldn’t we all simply have the attitude, “no one knows for sure”?
    Am I asking too many questions? Will someone answer?

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  28. Pingback: The Open Door » Pre-Trib Rapture Thoughts

  29. Once Confused, Yes, a babe in Christ doesn’t eat ‘meat’ right away for sure. And yes it is the most comforting thought to know who is in charge to save us and grow us up. Unfortunatly the ‘churches’ for the most part, will have you on pablum the rest of your days! Not all of them, but 99.9% of them. But praise God for His guiding and leading us. He does it all……..5 Solas!!

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  30. googli,

    Since you asked….:-) I believe you can be in grave danger should you live in the last seven years of this age if you do not have your eschatology nailed down. Jesus warned us many times to be watching. How will you know what to watch for if you are not reading the scriptures ahead of time?

    The upside is that none of the elect will be deceived by the anti-christ when he comes on the scene so take comfort in that. However you must be able to determine who Jesus the Lord, the real Jesus really is. Many will come in His name and claim to be the “Christ” or the “Messiah”. Most religions are expecting a “savior”. We are foretold than many will come claiming to be our Messiah. In the very last days someone will actually claim to be God. How will you know if the person is God, the anti-christ, a false messiah? The only way to be prepared is to know the good shepard, Jesus Christ, intimately. If you read His word, and not just the passages on eschatology, and pray for Jesus to be your Lord and reveal Himself to you, He will. Jesus says anyone who comes to Him He will in no wise cast out. Whew! But only those who know their God will endure to the end (meaning to their death). Now, this is my very best advice: Do not study theology or different end-time scenarios and then decide which one you believe. Each will have verses to support its view. DO NOT READ ANY BOOK WRITTEN BY ANY MAN. Instead read only the bible. Start with the Gospels. Read them over and over. Then read Acts and Romans to learn about the early church. Then go even further and read the letters called epistles to the early churches. These epistles introduce more eschatology (adding to what Jesus gives in the gospels) and give us such wonderful loving instruction on how to live in Christ while in this life on earth. Don’t forget Revelation. It is very important to read Revelation as it is the only book in the bible to promise a blessing to the reader. I think it promises blessings about 11 times. Read revelation over and over and then go back to the old testament and read the prophets, Daniel is excellent as is Isaiah, Ezekiel, etc. IN FACT IT’S ALL REALLY REALLY GOOD. And most important it is all true and God breathed. Most important before reading the eschatology is knowing WHO Jesus really is and then determining what your relationship to Him is. If you have already given your life to Jesus and your relationship with Him is that He is your precious Savior from sin and you are now repenting and following after the Lord Jesus then pray and read your bible. Ask the Lord to reveal the knowledge of the end-times to you. It is all there and He will do it if you ask. DO NOT TRUST IN MAN TO TELL YOU HOW IT WILL GO DOWN. Learn from the Lord through His word only. Then later, much later after the Holy Spirit has already confirmed in your own heart what the truth is and you want to discuss it with other believers fine. Just be sure in the Word alone why you believe what you believe. Otherwise you will be in danger of being swayed when a verse seems to uphold a certain view. The entire bible must uphold the entire truth or none of it is true period. (He showed me over a period of months (if that long) immersed in the bible. I wasn’t looking for it, He brought it to me and it was something that was the opposite of what I had been taught. (I know of at least two other posters on this site who learned the same eschatology that I did from reading the bible on their own without anyones opinion or book.) We all came to the same truth from the Holy Spirit guiding us and no one else. Just the Bible and the Holy Spirit. He will not steer you in the wrong direction. Just my advice since you asked 🙂 My prayers are with you dear one!

    Love in Christ,
    Rachel

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  31. Rachel,

    I don’t believe we will be deceived by a person claiming to be the Christ. We know that He will be coming in a cloud, everyone shall see Him, and even those who pierced Him. I agree with Mike. Full preterist think He was here during the fall of the temple.

    your sister

    Deborah

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  32. Pingback: Christian Values Do Not Exist Part II: The Motivation For Believing A Lie « Heal The Land With Spiritual Warfare

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